BRP Cares, please comment on the new line up.

[Deer Slayer]

Iesting! And I believe you are probably right.

Here's one thing about BRP that puzzles me, however.spite the temporary boom they got with the introduction of the new 1330 designs, we know that sales have dropped over the past few years, and it looks as though 2016 will be yet another down year for Spyder sales. If what you say is correct, in that the Spyder Line is still not a money maker after almost 10 years, then WHY did they just spend $14 million on the renovation of their "Museum of Ingenuity" in Valcourt? I admit that, over the years, they have displayed ingenuity that they can be proud of, but $14 million on renovations?? What's up with that? Was that decision based on some sort of "corporate vanity", or do they actually believe that investment will come back to them in future sales?

What's your take on that, Pirate?

Do not forget the money shoveled out to NASCAR CUP CRAP! That is why an F3 with a Daytona 500 sticker on it cost over $22,000 Yankee type. They are making money.

[Pirate looks at --]

Interesting! And I believe you are probably right.

Here's one thing about BRP that puzzles me, however... Despite the temporary boom they got with the introduction of the new 1330 designs, we know that sales have dropped over the past few years, and it looks as though 2016 will be yet another down year for Spyder sales. If what you say is correct, in that the Spyder Line is still not a money maker after almost 10 years, then WHY did they just spend $14 million on the renovation of their "Museum of Ingenuity" in Valcourt? I admit that, over the years, they have displayed ingenuity that they can be proud of, but $14 million on renovations?? What's up with that? Was that decision based on some sort of "corporate vanity", or do they actually believe that investment will come back to them in future sales?

What's your take on that, Pirate?

I missed this! I didn't say they were declaring bankruptcy, I said they aren't making money on spyders. So if they want to spend 14 million on legacy stuff, more power to them! They make a heck of a lot of other stuff!

[fritzer1]

This. We're (brpcare) here to help answer questions, help out folks when issues crop up, and address technical queries.


Bob, I suppose you could say that...

This is a rare opportunity for me to address BRP Cares directly - thanks
One of my questions/disappointments, which has been discussed ad nauseum and without resolve, is that my 2016 F3T does not have the 79tooth sprocket for touring gearing. The European models do, however, and now, much to my chagrin, so will the 2017 F3L.
Having depleted my meager retirement savings, it just will not be feasible to trade my 3 month old F3T for the newer, more appropriate model.
Question - which has been discussed previously - will it be possible to convert my bike to the higher gearing sprocket. If so, what steps and costs would be necessary?
An in depth answer would really be appreciated by this Vietnam Vet, anxious to do some serious touring with my wife.
Thanks, and have a blessed day - Fritz Barlag, Grain Valley, Mo.

[billybovine]

This is a rare opportunity for me to address BRP Cares directly - thanks
One of my questions/disappointments, which has been discussed ad nauseum and without resolve, is that my 2016 F3T does not have the 79tooth sprocket for touring gearing. The European models do, however, and now, much to my chagrin, so will the 2017 F3L.
Having depleted my meager retirement savings, it just will not be feasible to trade my 3 month old F3T for the newer, more appropriate model.
Question - which has been discussed previously - will it be possible to convert my bike to the higher gearing sprocket. If so, what steps and costs would be necessary?
An in depth answer would really be appreciated by this Vietnam Vet, anxious to do some serious touring with my wife.
Thanks, and have a blessed day - Fritz Barlag, Grain Valley, Mo.

Where did you get this info about the rear sprocket on the 2017 F3L. According to the parts fiche all versions of 2017 F3's north american models have the same 89 tooth rear sprocket. The same as previous years of F3.

[Bob Denman]

Billy,
I seem to recall something about the 2017 base, de-tuned model getting the 79 tooth rear cog...

But I haven't confirmed that to be true...

[billybovine]

Billy,
I seem to recall something about the 2017 base, de-tuned model getting the 79 tooth rear cog...

But I haven't confirmed that to be true...

Not according to the parts fiche. That's why I asked where that info come from.

[Santa & Mrs Claus]

What is the difference from the auto companies changing their lineup to BRP changing theirs?

We don't get up in arms over the auto companies so why should this be different.

If the RS & ST owners don't like the change then deal with another company..

[MRH]

There are some basic tenants of (still in business) companies.

Products are improved periodically. (If you buy the first or second model of just about anything, you know that the largest improvements are still ahead of you.)

Products that aren't profitable are discontinued. You can still get those products serviced and repaired, most of the time, but we don't have a right to expect that they will be offered forever. There are used markets, and I'll bet that there will be RSs and STs still to be found new for at least a year, if not longer. The RS will have had a ten year life, and the ST really ended up as failed experiment.

For BRP, or any company, to try to give us what we want (as a group), they have to give up things in other areas.



On another note, and this really isn't my business, but I also wasn't the one who brought it to the group, it isn't BRP's fault that anybody here took all of their money and put it into a motorcycle, an then improved it for the following year. Really?

[jcthorne]

Not according to the parts fiche. That's why I asked where that info come from.

The information about the smaller rear sprocket on the base model came from the 2017 dealer rollout. Its been seen and photographed with the smaller sprocket on the base model.

[jcthorne]

This is a rare opportunity for me to address BRP Cares directly - thanks
One of my questions/disappointments, which has been discussed ad nauseum and without resolve, is that my 2016 F3T does not have the 79tooth sprocket for touring gearing. The European models do, however, and now, much to my chagrin, so will the 2017 F3L.
Having depleted my meager retirement savings, it just will not be feasible to trade my 3 month old F3T for the newer, more appropriate model.
Question - which has been discussed previously - will it be possible to convert my bike to the higher gearing sprocket. If so, what steps and costs would be necessary?
An in depth answer would really be appreciated by this Vietnam Vet, anxious to do some serious touring with my wife.
Thanks, and have a blessed day - Fritz Barlag, Grain Valley, Mo.

No idea why you would want the smaller pulley on the F3. I just completed a 3 week trip of greater than 5000 miles on my F3. Not once was I riding down the highway saying to myself I sure wish I had less noise or better gas milage with lower gearing. I cruise at 85 or so and still get 38 mpg which is 2 better than the RTs in our group.

[billybovine]

The information about the smaller rear sprocket on the base model came from the 2017 dealer rollout. Its been seen and photographed with the smaller sprocket on the base model.

OK I just found a youtube video mentioning the smaller sprocket on the base model. Not on the F3L as someone mention in another post. Must have been a last minute choice before production. Not on the parts fiche and the F3 owners manual says 89 tooth for all models as well.

[fritzer1]

No idea why you would want the smaller pulley on the F3. I just completed a 3 week trip of greater than 5000 miles on my F3. Not once was I riding down the highway saying to myself I sure wish I had less noise or better gas milage with lower gearing. I cruise at 85 or so and still get 38 mpg which is 2 better than the RTs in our group.

Well, JC - I ain't you and you ain't me. There are rational reasons 79tooth sprockets were put on the RT models and the European F3T & L models for touring. Even our renowned and respected Lamont of Lamonster Garage has indicated a desire for this and even a 7th gear. You might ask him, "why on earth for".

In my 70+ years, I have bombed all over America and Europe, riding one up with nary a concern about speed limits and roaring pipes. Now, I'd like to enjoy many leisure miles of 2-up riding with my 70 year-old wife.

As has been stated many times over on these forums - to each his own - I will be the last person to ridicule anyone else's ride, riding style or attitude.

And, by the way, at 71 years of age, I just completed a 3,000 mile unsupported bicycle ride from San Diego, California to St. Augustine, Florida. Now, go ahead and ask me, as many others have, "what the hell compelled you to do that?"

Blessings - I do enjoy your contribution to these forums.

[Bob Denman]

Who's in need of a Snickers Bar?

[jcthorne]

Well, JC - I ain't you and you ain't me. There are rational reasons 79tooth sprockets were put on the RT models and the European F3T & L models for touring. Even our renowned and respected Lamont of Lamonster Garage has indicated a desire for this and even a 7th gear. You might ask him, "why on earth for".

In my 70+ years, I have bombed all over America and Europe, riding one up with nary a concern about speed limits and roaring pipes. Now, I'd like to enjoy many leisure miles of 2-up riding with my 70 year-old wife.

As has been stated many times over on these forums - to each his own - I will be the last person to ridicule anyone else's ride, riding style or attitude.

And, by the way, at 71 years of age, I just completed a 3,000 mile unsupported bicycle ride from San Diego, California to St. Augustine, Florida. Now, go ahead and ask me, as many others have, "what the hell compelled you to do that?"

Blessings - I do enjoy your contribution to these forums.

I did not state my response well. I apologize.

I was trying to understand what it was you thought the smaller pulley was going to do for you while cruising on the freeway. At any speed up to well above the posted limits, the F3 pulley just does not have the ace engine spinning fast enough to be a problem. It's well inside its efficient torque curve range. I actually think the RT could benefit from the larger pulley. The only real downside to the large pulley has been the belt harmonics from the long belt. That issue is or has been solved with a small tensioner device.

Guess what I am trying to say is that the slight reduction in RPM for a given speed does not result in significant reduction in noise or vibration, nor does it lessen fuel consumption. It does cause a significant increase in gear shifts on the freeway.

[Bob Denman]

I rode to SpyderFest with a couple of F-3s.
We were comparing our fuel usages during this ride, and my RT was always using just a wee bit less fuel, than the un-faired bikes. I would say that aerodynamics made the difference in fuel economy: not the gearing.

[fritzer1]

I did not state my response well. I apologize.

I was trying to understand what it was you thought the smaller pulley was going to do for you while cruising on the freeway. At any speed up to well above the posted limits, the F3 pulley just does not have the ace engine spinning fast enough to be a problem. It's well inside its efficient torque curve range. I actually think the RT could benefit from the larger pulley. The only real downside to the large pulley has been the belt harmonics from the long belt. That issue is or has been solved with a small tensioner device.

Guess what I am trying to say is that the slight reduction in RPM for a given speed does not result in significant reduction in noise or vibration, nor does it lessen fuel consumption. It does cause a significant increase in gear shifts on the freeway.

It's all good, JC - hope to meet you sometime either at Spyderfest or soon at Lamonster's BBQ.
Incidentally, I rode through/around Houston(your home?) during all the rain and flooding back in April - what a mess.
Blessings, Fritz

[WackyDan]

I may be in left field. I can not ryde the F3 fue to forward controls. I have read others with back problems that have the same problem. I ryde the RS-S so I can stand on the pegs to prevent that big ole rear wheel from pounding my spine. Yeah, I know U-fit, but does not come back far enough as to allow one to relieve pressure on the spine. There are many folks don't like or can use forward controls (birthing position ). I think the U-fit can be modified to slide the pegs far enough back, I have been working up a design for me. We will have to see. The F3 getting slower with all the added weight. The RS-S in 0 to 60 is faster due to light weight. The 1330 eng in the RS-S frame would be fun. Ryde on ya'll.

My F3-s is lighter at 640 dry. My GS was 697 dry. I can tell you right now, the F3 is faster 0-60.

[billrob71]

My F3-s is lighter at 640 dry. My GS was 697 dry. I can tell you right now, the F3 is faster 0-60.

I dont get around here much any more but Id figured Id ask this I thought F3 dry weight was just shy of 900 pounds and not saying my RSS is a rocket by any means but Ive been up against a F3 playing around and it was not faster. Even seeing this comercial with the F3 racing around a professional race track and getting little over 120 mph come on. 125 ive seen on mine and im 220 in weight. My spyder is my second bike and I dont ride it a whole lot anymore but it is still fun to fo out and play around with.
What ever BRP has up on the horizon they need to put some real effort , unlocking the stability system like the direction it looks like they went on the Daytona bike is a good start , think that was my really only one complaint I had with my RSS. For the price there asking for the Daytona F3 is probably little much.

Have fun guys

[Deer Slayer]

My F3-s is lighter at 640 dry. My GS was 697 dry. I can tell you right now, the F3 is faster 0-60.

As I remember, the 2015 BRP spec sheet stated the F3 was .3 sec slower at 0 to 60 compaired to the RS.

[Bob Denman]

Per the 2016 catalog: it shows 850 pounds for the F3, and F3-S...

[Buckeye Bleau]

I think that many of you are missing one of the key market segments that BRP is focusing on. Yes, the 95% market is huge, and 2 wheelers have and MAY show interest in the products.

During the Live from Orlando video they mention that nearly a third of new Spyder owners are new to motorcycles, this may be a larger market to capture. Think of the Boomers retiring, looking for fun and recreation. Hey, as a former Business Development manager, this appears to be the direction they are going. Just my humble opinion!

Joe

[Bob Denman]

There's no doubt that if they can make inroads into an entirely new market segment: it'll allow for more future growth, than just fighting among the other manufacturers for the current marketplace.

[Pirate looks at --]

I think that many of you are missing one of the key market segments that BRP is focusing on. Yes, the 95% market is huge, and 2 wheelers have and MAY show interest in the products.

During the Live from Orlando video they mention that nearly a third of new Spyder owners are new to motorcycles, this may be a larger market to capture. Think of the Boomers retiring, looking for fun and recreation. Hey, as a former Business Development manager, this appears to be the direction they are going. Just my humble opinion!

Joe

I have it as a fact BRP is focused on non MC people 100%. They will get some motorcycle riders, but they want the bigger picture!

[WackyDan]

Per the 2016 catalog: it shows 850 pounds for the F3, and F3-S...

I was going by a sticker I found on the swing arm... THe catalog is probably right.

[BRPcare]

Question - which has been discussed previously - will it be possible to convert my bike to the higher gearing sprocket. If so, what steps and costs would be necessary

Hi fritzer1,
Yes it is possible to install the 79 tooth sprocket. You will need the sprocket itself (and labor to install it), and note that it will need to be hooked up to BUDS by a dealer so that you can select the right sprocket size to correct speedo readings once changed.
Hope this helps,
Steve