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2024 RT L back at the dealer for the 9th time in 3 months!! How long until you give up?

Graderman

Graderman

Member
My new in crate 2024 RT L was purchased exactly 3 months ago. I have had the machine in at the dealer 9 times. I've experienced mysterious shutting down for no reason requiring the battery to be disconnected to restart. Suspension faults due to improper assembly, alternator shaft requires replacement. VSS faults and limp mode. Improper installation of accessories by what I honestly call a good dealer. I've had it towed once and jump started 3 times. I've had to cut vacations short due to mechanical issues. And yesterday I was blessed with 5 VSS alarms and a limp home code.
I bought this vehicle in good faith to enjoy my retirement. I had intended to tow a trailer and circumnavigate North America but I don't trust it to go around the block.
The dealer, has been good - to a point - when I had them install the BajaRon sway bar they screwed the installation and subsequently I had to return Twice(!) to have the install fixed.
My dealer is trying to get BRP to pony up something for all this grief but from my point of view what good is it if I don't trust the bike to make it home.

Thanks for listening folks. Don't mean to be a downer. I absolutely love riding the Spyder but I used to love my ex too...

Thoughts?
 
I would be very close to lawyering up at this point and filing for lemon law and get my money back. It is also apparent your dealer doesn't have a clue. I truly wish you the best !! Please keep us updated.
 
I agree with Graderman - it's time to look up the Lemon Law information and take more definitive action. I don't really see that you have much of a choice at this point. Sorry you are dealing with this.
 
The dealer got my new 2019 in the crate and did their so-called assembly and servicing. I took it home on a trailer, because I had nobody handy to give me a ride down there. I unloaded it off the trailer and went over the whole thing. Good thing I did too. Some bolts just finger tight. Fluid levels way over-full. Looked like a class of third graders assembled it as their class project. That was over 5 years ago and it never went back to that dealer or any dealer again. Never had any more problems. Everything else has been normal wear items.
 
I didn't realize you are a northern brother. I would still contact an attorney and see what consumer laws would apply. You folks can't buy something and not have any protection. I would also be looking into another dealer in my area.
 
American Lemon Laws generally apply to all vehicles sold in the United States, regardless of their country of origin. Lemon laws apply to vehicles sold or leased within a given jurisdiction. Check with your state for how a lemon law, if they have one, can be accessed. BRP has to comply to sell their vehicles here.

I call them 'Customer Abuse' laws.

Added Notation:
Sorry, I didn't pick up on the fact that you are in Canada. So my reply is not of much benefit. I wish you the best of luck on your quest for a reliable machine. I'm sure everyone here agrees that it should not be such a struggle.
 
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For the size of BRP, and all the various vehicles they make - Their dealer tech requirements and training down right sucks. For expensive products, both retailor and BRP Corp are overall very bad at responding to problems and getting repair parts out in a timely fashion. No way would the buying public for cars put up with long repair times, poor recall procedures' , and sloppy repairs.
I live in a area where there is about 3 dealers within 40 miles. Wouldn"t go to any of them except for warranty/recall work. I am blessed to have a local rider in our group, who knows more about Spiders, has the technical knowledge and computer equipment to handle 99% of the maintenance.
A dealer will never touch my bike except for the areas mentioned above. Oh and he is usually cheaper.
 
JayBros, the dealer has opened a case with BRP.
I am having productive discussions with all departments and all levels of management, including the owner. I believe they are trying their best to help.
In talking to the service writer and listening to a couple of conversations he’s had with BRP it feels to me that they are more of a problem than the dealer.

But all that is inconsequential really. My biggest issue now is that I have zero trust in this machine. I had planned to be riding all over the countryside, making the most out of retirement. Instead, I’m nervous about taking it more than a few miles from home due to the horrible record this bike has. Even if they finally replace the alternator shaft and find the cause of the latest VSS code/limp problems, I still won’t trust it.
 
Graderman said:
JayBros, the dealer has opened a case with BRP.
I am having productive discussions with all departments and all levels of management, including the owner. I believe they are trying their best to help.
In talking to the service writer and listening to a couple of conversations he’s had with BRP it feels to me that they are more of a problem than the dealer.

But all that is inconsequential really. My biggest issue now is that I have zero trust in this machine. I had planned to be riding all over the countryside, making the most out of retirement. Instead, I’m nervous about taking it more than a few miles from home due to the horrible record this bike has. Even if they finally replace the alternator shaft and find the cause of the latest VSS code/limp problems, I still won’t trust it.
Click to expand...

Bugga!! :eek: That's definitely NOT a good feeling. 😣

Maybe you got a 'built late on a Friday arvo before the Holidays & after a boozy lunch' Spyder, hot off the production line?? Or maybe there's some other reason you've scored a dud, but seriously, while it's looking that < way, there's waaaayyy more people out there who have either lucked out and got better machines, &/or a few who've had a bad run initially, but then got over that and have had a near perfect run ever since; and there's heaps who've never had a real reason to complain... So if you think the dealer is good, then the odds are very good that you could do better with a different machine... ;)

So maybe you should try to cut your losses on that one? You could even see if the dealer will take it back as a trade-in on an already proven older model so that you're not out of pocket too much?? :unsure: Just don't go 'older with low mileage' and risk buying someone else's similar problem - you'd want to get a bike that's been ridden and has a proven 'good' track record! :sneaky:

Mind you, I personally think the later model Spyders might be good when/if they're good; but when they're bad, they're absofreakinlutely rotten!🤬 I'd even go so far as to say that, in my opinion, it seems to me that BRP started progressively letting the quality of the Spyders they produce slip with the overall product AND the components they put into the Spyders from about 2020 on, maybe even 2018-ish; and that the VERY BEST Spyders you can get are the 2012/2013's (post heat recall) in the V-Twins, or the 2014-2017-ish Spyders if you want the 1330 motor, before they started tarting up the digital dash with useless fripperies!?! In fact, now that I've said that, I wonder if it was the higher costs of the dash upgrades that made them start trying to cut costs elsewhere and dump cheap crap parts into the Spyders, instead of continuing with the better quality gear and higher degree of quality control?? :oops:

Just Wonderin'... :sneaky:
 
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I would take it to a dealer who is known to be reliable and good. Trade the damn thing in and get a new one. You will never be happy with the one you have now no matter how they say its fixed, as it hasn't been so far. Don't go to the dealer who has been working on it, as they aren't competent enough to fix it in the first place. Just my opinion.
 
ned64 said:
I would take it to a dealer who is known to be reliable and good. Trade the damn thing in and get a new one. You will never be happy with the one you have now no matter how they say its fixed, as it hasn't been so far. Don't go to the dealer who has been working on it, as they aren't competent enough to fix it in the first place. Just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Kinda agree, but finding a dealer willing to make 1/2 decent offer, however... & this time of year!?!

Don’t give up on the traveling goals, this may only be a delay - like when you can’t find your keys, then when eventually do & finally get on your way, you pass that horrible wreck that could have been you if you'd left when you originally planned!!
 
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Graderman said:
My new in crate 2024 RT L was purchased exactly 3 months ago.
Click to expand...

This amount of problems is unacceptable in a new Spyder, and my opinion is that it shouldn't be your problem to trade it in on another one to get yourself out of the mess BRP/dealer has put you in. I would think another dealer would wonder 'Why is this being traded when it's so new?' and would be very cautious... and either refuse to trade it at all, or give you a lowball offer. Now BRP is involved, all these issues might even be logged against your VIN, so any other dealer mightn't touch it anyway.

Your dealer, while doing what they can to help, might just be out of their depth.

I'd suggest getting a copy of the BRP case number (if there is such a thing) and contacting BRP yourself to bring some extra pressure to bear. Your dealer might get upset at you going around them, but too bad... you just want to get what's right. If BRP still move at a glacial speed... mention you 'Don't want to have to get CAMVAP involved' to them and see if that helps. BRP are not a participating member but they still wouldn't want to be on the receiving end. If that still doesn't help... open a CAMVAP case.

Lawyering-up seems to be a sure way for everyone to down-tools and it'll just drag on and on. CAMVAP seems to say their process is usually complete in just 90 days.
 
I must say, reading Graderman's reply the situation appears to be a mega-soup sandwich. Having no idea how CAMVAP works or what it takes out of a product owner's wallet to build a solid case in the owner's favor, my only remaining suggestion is a personal entreaty to the dealership owner to get on the phone with someone of consequence at BRP and tell them the situation is totally out of hand and you, BRP, need to pick up the tab for this POS and let me replace the defective machine that you folks can't fix out of your goodwill account. Either that or you, BRP, send a factory technician to my dealership to assume service responsibility for the vehicle until all the problems are completely fixed.

I know there are many MY 2020 and later owners who are well satisfied with their rides, but the tales I've read about problems with the current generation of roadsters makes me appreciate my 2014 more than ever.
 
Peter Aawen said:
Mind you, I personally think the later model Spyders might be good when/if they're good; but when they're bad, they're absofreakinlutely rotten!🤬 I'd even go so far as to say that, in my opinion, it seems to me that BRP started progressively letting the quality of the Spyders they produce slip with the overall product AND the components they put into the Spyders from about 2020 on, maybe even 2018-ish; and that the VERY BEST Spyders you can get are the 2012/2013's (post heat recall) in the V-Twins, or the 2014-2017-ish Spyders if you want the 1330 motor, before they started tarting up the digital dash with useless fripperies!?! In fact, now that I've said that, I wonder if it was the higher costs of the dash upgrades that made them start trying to cut costs elsewhere and dump cheap crap parts into the Spyders, instead of continuing with the better quality gear and higher degree of quality control?? :oops:

Just Wonderin'... :sneaky:
Click to expand...
I agree 100%. Even though I just finished a 9,045 mile cross country trip on my 2021 RTL with zero issues, I still have had more troubles previously on that bike than I did on any of the 5 other Spyders that I have owned. One was a 2012 RSS; one a 2014 RT,; and 3 x 2016 F3 Series bikes. They had all been nearly flawless. One thing that I have noticed about the pricing on the new Spyders is that people forget that the prices actually went down in 2020 across the board. In fact, in 2014 a new RTL cost about $30k plus. When you look at things that way, todays pricing isn't too bad. More than I would ever pay, but not too bad overall.
 
Perhaps I've misread all the comments and suggestions, but all blame seems to be placed on BRP. However, in this case it's not all on them. Graderman listed 8 problems. 5 seem to be BRP issues and 3 Dealer issues. Whether Dealer or BRP issues, none should occur with a new ride. From what I've read on this site 4 of the 5 issues attributed to BRP may be battery related. The 3 Dealer issues seem to be incompetence, although the Dealer is described as good.

I would like to know if the defects have been corrected, and if the battery has been replaced with a better battery.
  • Mysterious shutting down for no reason requiring the battery to be disconnected to restart
    • Appears to be BRP issue. Possibly related to the poor-quality battery BRP has been using.
  • Alternator shaft requires replacement.
    • Appears to be BRP issue.
  • VSS faults and limp mode.
    • Appears to be BRP issue. Possibly related to the poor-quality battery.
  • Towed once and jump started 3 times.
    • Appears to be BRP issue. Possibly related to the poor-quality battery.
  • Blessed with 5 VSS alarms and a limp home code.
    • Appears to be BRP issue. Possibly related to the poor-quality battery.
  • Suspension faults due to improper assembly.
    • Appears to be Dealer issue.
  • Improper installation of accessories.
    • Appears to be Dealer issue.
  • Install the BajaRon sway bar they screwed the installation and subsequently I had to return Twice(!) to have the install fixed.
    • Appears to be Dealer issue.
 
I would suspect that most of the laundry list of problems you listed could be traced to a single source. Electrical issues with a CANBUS system can be caused by a single issue. I've seen it in the car world. A single issue can cause a cascade effect showing fault codes and other issues that don't truly exist. For example, if your alternator is faulty and sending erratic voltage levels out, it could cause other issues that show as faults when none truly exist.

I would suggest that possibly the dealer doesn't have a tech on board who is experienced in CANBUS related electrical gremlins.

So, this is my way of saying the problems may not be as bad as they first appear to be.
 
I appreciate all the replies, support and suggestions. I'm taking the RT in to the dealer this morning. They have a Canyon demo for to use for the time being.
As I stated earlier, I have no confidence in my RT and given how much time and money I've already spent I don't want to have to do it all over again on another Spyder that may or may not have issues. From my perspective - and I know it is a clouded perspective at this point - buying anything from BRP is a crap shoot. So a trade in is, in my opinion, not the answer. When they get the VSS and alternator shaft fixed I still won't trust it. Too many problems already to expect that it'll be fine.
I'll be talking to BRP shortly and get a feel for what they have to say... When I do get to the dealer I'll be asking them about selling it with zero commission etc. I just want out. I don't want any more expense or frustration and ruined vacation plans.. This is going to end up costing me thousands and thousands of dollars. And what really sucks is the Spyder, if it was reliable and had a reliable dealer network, would be as close to perfect for me as I could ask for. I'll take a bunch of the blame for not doing enough due diligence. Live, pay and learn.
 
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