I've gone from ATGATT to H (just Helmet).

[Gwolf]

It is not about a Spyder being just as dangerous as a two wheel motorcycle or as a high speed jet ski. What it is about is the fact that you are riding wide open and exposed completely to anything that might hit you or that you might hit before coming to a complete stop. You are not surrounded by several tons of metal with seat belts, air bags, or crush zones. You are just as exposed as you would be coming off of a horse or any other animal or machine. The only protection you have is what you decide to wear in addition to your normal clothing. I am not for mandatory legally required safety gear. I do think it is a good idea to protect the parts you would not like to lose when you get into a situation there is no way to avoid.

 

[vito1943]

Raven: What "religious group" is exempt from helmet laws?

 

[racoon]

Raven: What "religious group" is exempt from helmet laws?

Google seems to think some States exempt turban wearing Sikhs.

Tennessee has tried to pass a similar law, but it failed passage.

 

[weeneil]

Raven: What "religious group" is exempt from helmet laws?

Google seems to think some States exempt turban wearing Sikhs.

Tennessee has tried to pass a similar law, but it failed passage.

In Britain Sikhs have been exempt from the day the helmet law was introduced to us many years ago

 

[Lctriple]

It is not about a Spyder being just as dangerous as a two wheel motorcycle or as a high speed jet ski. What it is about is the fact that you are riding wide open and exposed completely to anything that might hit you or that you might hit before coming to a complete stop. You are not surrounded by several tons of metal with seat belts, air bags, or crush zones. You are just as exposed as you would be coming off of a horse or any other animal or machine. The only protection you have is what you decide to wear in addition to your normal clothing. I am not for mandatory legally required safety gear. I do think it is a good idea to protect the parts you would not like to lose when you get into a situation there is no way to avoid.

That's exactly how I feel. You put it into words better though.

 

[Raven]

Back to the subject at hand.
My biggest fear is something hooking a front wheel.
I think if that happened, you are going for ride that will not end well.
Almost happened to me twice. Some idiot pulling out to pass, I headed for the shoulder and almost didn't make it.

 

[canamjhb]

I migrated from almost all the gear all the time to comfortable protective gear all the time. Always wore at least blue jeans (+chaps and long johns when it got colder), over the ankle riding boots, modular helmet, fingerless nose pickers (full gauntlet leather gloves when it got cooler), and riding jacket. I had a winter and a summer jacket. Winter was heavy leather with liner. Summer was a mesh with armor +optional liner. Hot and even moderately warm days here in the Arizona desert are too uncomfortable and dangerous to ride with exposed skin. My summer mesh jacket actually kept me cooler on warm days than riding without it on. Helmet, boots, jeans, jacket, and nose pickers were always on before leaving the driveway (at a minimum). I had the unpleasant experience of riding through a swarm of bees once and a swarm of locust another time. Both times I had to pull over to clean myself and the bike up in order to continue riding. Bugs bouncing off my helmet made it sound like I was in a popcorn machine. Can't imagine how it would have felt without protection......

 

[Danvirsse]

I'm in the ATGATT camp. Everyone should do what they're comfortable with, whether on 3 wheels or 2.

 

[Peacekeeper6]

I've been riding motorcycles for over 40 years, and for most of those years I was an ATGATT guy (All the gear, all the time). Especially when I was an MSF Instructor (Motorcycle Safety Foundation) I felt a personal obligation to never be seen with less protective gear than what I recommended to my students. But as I got older and more experienced I more or less became a MTGMTT rider (Most of the gear, most of the time) and then, to be honest, I was more of a STGSTT (Some of the gear, some of the time) rider. When I switched from the Goldwing to the Spyder, my confidence that I would not end up on the ground grew and I am convinced that there is good reason for having this confidence. The stability of three wheels, and the larger front profile making me much more likely to be seen by oncoming traffic and thus less likely to have a vehicle make a left turn right in front of me, led to feeling even less concerned about safety gear.

I can't recall the last time that I put on actual motorcycle boots when riding the Spyder. My leather chaps and old riding pants have not come out of the closet in several years. Fingerless gloves are my normal wear now, with the old armored, full gauntlet gloves mostly gathering dust. And in this beautiful weather that I have had the good fortune to have recently, my several different motorcycle jackets have stayed in the closet for the most part. Yesterday was a perfect riding day, with blue skies and temps in the high 70's. So yesterday I moved all the way from ATGATT to H, meaning I was in tennis sneakers, shorts, a t-shirt, no gloves and a helmet. Even the helmet was my open faced LS2 rather than my modular Shoei.

I know that even on a Spyder I could get hit and knocked to the ground. I have no seatbelt or air bag to truly protect me. But riding as I did yesterday was exhilarating and full of the joy that I only experience on a motorcycle and only when not encased in gear which almost feels like riding in my car. At 82 I don't know how many more riding seasons are in store for me, but riding with just a helmet (and I doubt that I will ever ride without one for any distance or time) is, for me, making the most of the rides that I have left to me.

Nope, you don't need our disapproval from those ATGATT people.

You do whatever you want, whatever makes you happy, especially at your age.

 

[pegasus1300]

I know this thread is 7 months old but as riding season comes on us I thought it might be good to bring to the front again. I learned to ride in Argentina in the early 60's on a DKW 200CC. No nothing. No gloves, jacket, helmet, boots, just whatever came out of the closet. When I came back to the USA and bought a motorcycle I bought a helmet with it and have always been a helmet wearer. The rest of the gear came as time and finances allowed. I switched from fingerless gloves to full after watching the skin get scrubbed off while sliding down the road. Both pre and post Spyder I sometimes go all gear and sometimes not, though always helmet and gloves. Again, whatever else I felt was needful for the weather and the distance. Whether true or not, I do feel safer on the Spyder. At 79, I do have to make a deliberate effort to keep my situational awareness active, thus I don't ride as long or as far as I did in the old days. Not having to balance has freed up a considerable portion of my brain for that activity.
Whatever level of dress suits you, be careful out there, so you can tell us your stories come fall.

 

[mecsw500]

Raven: What "religious group" is exempt from helmet laws?

Some jurisdictions or countries exempt observant Sikhs.

 

[UtahPete]

There are too many idiots on the road these days not to be a ATGATT person.
Three wheels are more stable. But if you do get in a crash in will not be good.
I know "Oh, I am just going to the store" - that's when something bad happens.

How would armored jacket and pants protect you in a crash? Armored gear is designed for protection falling off or sliding down the road, not severe impact with another large object.

The last time I rode a motorcycle I ended up in somebody's front yard not knowing what just happened. 7 ribs broken in a bunch of places, a broken collarbone, a torn ligament in my thumb, and a concussion, but very little road rash. Wearing full protection saved me from much worse injuries. I'm still going with full face helmet, padded jacket and pants, boots, and gloves, or my Aerostitch Roadcrafter. As far as I'm concerned, a Spyder is just as dangerous as a motorcycle.

Please explain how a Spyder is just as dangerous as a motorcycle, in your opinion. Otherwise your crash experience on a 2-wheeler has questionable relevance to this topic, it seems to me. Thanks.

Yesterday was heating up and I decided to go out for a short ride of about an hour on local country roads. I went out again in shorts, sneakers, and a t-shirt. I did put on my 3/4 helmet and fingerless gloves. This non-ATGATT riding is getting addictive. Maybe the odds will catch up to me, but maybe not. As I finished my ride I was stopped at a red light not far from my house and it felt really hot, even with the little bit of clothing I was wearing. Opposite of me was a guy on a sport bike in full leathers and a full face helmet. He had to be roasting while waiting for the light to change. I'll admit that if I were that hot it would more than offset the fun of riding completely. But each of us has to do what we think is best for us at the time.

I share your philosophy 100%. What is the point of an incremental margin of safety if it results in a miserable ride experience? The helmet to me is always mandatory but on a Spyder everything else is optional, depending on weather conditions.

 

[racoon]

Please explain how a Spyder is just as dangerous as a motorcycle, in your opinion. Otherwise your crash experience on a 2-wheeler has questionable relevance to this topic, it seems to me. Thanks.

Because it's not just falling off and sliding, it's also running into things, running into other vehicles, and running off the road into a ditch.

 

[UtahPete]

It is not about a Spyder being just as dangerous as a two wheel motorcycle or as a high speed jet ski. What it is about is the fact that you are riding wide open and exposed completely to anything that might hit you or that you might hit before coming to a complete stop. You are not surrounded by several tons of metal with seat belts, air bags, or crush zones. You are just as exposed as you would be coming off of a horse or any other animal or machine. The only protection you have is what you decide to wear in addition to your normal clothing. I am not for mandatory legally required safety gear. I do think it is a good idea to protect the parts you would not like to lose when you get into a situation there is no way to avoid.

Other than the helmet, how does armored riding gear protect a Spyder rider from severe impact? I don't understand your reasoning.

 

[RogerC60]

One very likely scenario is a car rear bumper clipping your Spyder's front end (cutting in front of you on the highway). If the Spyder's front end is pushed sideways hard enough, would it roll?

If your Spyder is rear-ended at a traffic light it's possible (maybe even likely) that you would go tumbling off the bike onto the road. Anybody disagree?

 

[UtahPete]

Because it's not just falling off and sliding, it's also running into things, running into other vehicles, and running off the road into a ditch.

So, you believe those accidents are just as likely on a Spyder as on a 2-wheeler? I still don't understand your reasoning. I'm not questioning your preferences, just your reasoning. Thanks.

One very likely scenario is a car rear bumper clipping your Spyder's front end (cutting in front of you on the highway). If the Spyder's front end is pushed sideways hard enough, would it roll?

I think in that (extremely unlikely) scenario, the Spyder would be pushed off course and possibly disabled. Maybe roll over, who can tell? A 2-wheeler would go down, violently.

 

[RogerC60]

I think in that (extremely unlikely) scenario, the Spyder would be pushed off course and possibly disabled. Maybe roll over, who can tell? A 2-wheeler would go down, violently.

Maybe extremely unlikely, but the way folks drive around here I think it would be the most likely cause of my having an accident on my Spyder.

Let's think about possible causes of accidents on motorcycles (both 2- and 3-wheeled).

1. Losing traction in a corner
   2-wheels: low side and maybe high side, you come off
   3-wheels: you maybe slide into the ditch or into oncoming traffic (very unlikely)
2. Car pulls out in front of you or turns left in front of you
   2-wheels: you go over the handlebars and collide/crash/slide
   3-wheels: you go over the handlebars and collide/crash/slide
3. Rear-ended at a traffic light
   2-wheels: bike lurches violently forward, you fall off and slide
   3-wheels: bike lurches violently forward, you might fall off and slide (less likely)

I think for situations 1 and 3 you are a bit less likely to hit the pavement if you're on a Spyder than on a 2-wheeler.

I'm just putting this out there to spur discussion. I'm not saying my assessments are correct, but I think they are food for thought.

 

[Raven]

How would armored jacket and pants protect you in a crash? Armored gear is designed for protection falling off or sliding down the road, not severe impact with another large object.

I guess you have never done a big hi-side on a two wheeler.
Wear what you want, it's your choice.
Me, I will stick with my Aplinestar armored leather jackets (leftovers from my motorcycle days)

 

[Lctriple]

How would armored jacket and pants protect you in a crash? Armored gear is designed for protection falling off or sliding down the road, not severe impact with another large object.


Please explain how a Spyder is just as dangerous as a motorcycle, in your opinion. Otherwise your crash experience on a 2-wheeler has questionable relevance to this topic, it seems to me. Thanks.


I share your philosophy 100%. What is the point of an incremental margin of safety if it results in a miserable ride experience? The helmet to me is always mandatory but on a Spyder everything else is optional, depending on weather conditions.

You're just as vulnerable on three wheels as 2 wheels. There is NO protection on either vehicle, same on a four wheeler with handlebars. No seat belt, no cage protecting you, nothing to stop you from flying off the vehicle. The fact that this has to be explained to you is kinda worrying.

If you hit another large object head on, you're dead! If you glance off it, you have a chance, provided you're wearing something between you and the point of abrasion. If you get enough road rash, you'll wish you were dead anyway!

Other than the helmet, how does armored riding gear protect a Spyder rider from severe impact? I don't understand your reasoning.

What make you think a helmet will protect you? It's just plastic, styrofoam, and a little padding for comfort.

 

[mecsw500]

So, you believe those accidents are just as likely on a Spyder as on a 2-wheeler? I still don't understand your reasoning. I'm not questioning your preferences, just your reasoning. Thanks.


I think in that (extremely unlikely) scenario, the Spyder would be pushed off course and possibly disabled. Maybe roll over, who can tell? A 2-wheeler would go down, violently.

I think the difference in injury accident likelihoods between motorcycles and Spyders is not really relevant. In both cases you don't have a protective crumple zone cage around you, with seatbelts and airbag systems. I suspect that severe accident consequences are closer together in likelihood Spyders and motorcycles in number with both being far, far higher than severe accident consequences in a car. If I'm in a likely moderate collision in a car compared with a motorcycle and a Spyder, I'm walking away from the car and the difference between the motorcycle and a Spyder might just come down to slight differences in severity of pretty much the same types of injuries. Where the Spyder wins over the motorcycle is in minor tip offs at slower speeds.

So, when out on the road, motorcycle and Spyder, I wear a jacket and gloves rated with current EU protection standard armor.

Having walked away from absolutely horrendous motorcycle accidents in the past, I can personally attest to the protection afforded by properly certified riding gear with inbuilt armor. Now, on my Spyder, I do use a vented Klim jacket with inbuilt armor in summer with Alpine Stars summer gloves, stout jeans, steel toe capped over the ankle boots, and a modular Shoei helmet. My wife wears the same. This is less than the full leathers I wore on my motorcycles because the speeds I ride at are much slower and I feel the heat more, so overheating is now a major concern at my age. This is a risk v. reward calculation though. When the weather cools I'm back to a high quality leather jacket with built in armor and stouter gloves.

I'm not saying everybody doesn't evaluate risk in their own way and come to their own conclusion, that's a personal thing. This is just how I feel about the likelihood of being in an injury accident with a Spyder versus a motorcycle, and compared with a car, and how I dress to mitigate the risk for me personally.